348. High Pressure, High Innovation: Alexey Popov’s Journey in Aviation Technology

Alexey, such a pleasure to see you today. How's everything going?  Uh, hi, Cindy. Thanks for inviting. Everything is very well. I'm in the middle of nowhere in Italy, traveling, um, from, uh, Zurich to, uh, Cannes.  Nice. Yeah. Nice. Nice. Glad to see you and your audience and, uh, thank you for inviting me.  Absolutely.

Yeah. I mean, it sounds like you're doing some really amazing things. Um, for the audience, Alexi is the CEO and creator of Sirius Aviation AG, the first, the world's first hydrogen powered regional aircraft.  Really awesome, right? Cause it's awesome for the planet. So that's incredible.  Tell us your backstory because apparently you have a family legacy of like 50 years in aviation, um, aviation engineering and design.

That's pretty awesome. Uh,  yes, and, uh, I'm a legacy leader and a pilot. With over a decade of experience, I crossed Atlantic ocean and all my life, me and my family will be involved into aviation design and engineering and service. So I'm quite experienced. I basically have never done anything else in life except for aviation and things that surround it. 

So basically from, from the time you were a little kid, you were probably sitting in the co pilot seat of an airplane. Yes, I believe so.  Absolutely. My biggest dreams have been always related to aviation and things around.  Yeah. So  let's talk about being a CEO of a company because You know, this is a happiness podcast. 

Being a CEO sounds really glamorous and everything, but how do you choose happiness on a, on a daily basis when you're running a company that's. You know, I mean, it's kind of can be stressful.  Yes, that is absolutely stressful. Uh,  for asking, but you know, um, uh, eventually you find yourself in the situation where you have to be, you have a choice, either you are happy or you are not.

And, you know, I've never been running a company that designs an aircraft of such kind of, especially of complexity. Uh, we designed a very complex, um, engineering, uh, product. And nonetheless, I've been involved all my life and I've been prepared for this, but running as, uh, you know, as a CEO, a company that's a bit different.

So you have the worst things to manage and this is actually your, your, uh, self confidence and a lot of different things, they dropped quite often. So you deal with your employees, you deal with your senior staff, you deal with engineering and, um,  Uh, all of that is, uh, with absolutely different kind of weather around you, you know, people around you.

Then you have to travel, then you have problems or issues with your girlfriend, for example, and so on and so forth. But you asked me absolutely a correct question. And you know what, what I can tell you very, uh, briefly that this is your decision. So once you,  once you come to the point when a lot of stress falls down on you, you just have to, you know, Uh, shake yourself.

I was this Taylor sweet song. Yeah. Shake yourself or shake it. I don't remember. Shake it, shake it. Yeah. Yeah. You have to shake, shake it off. Absolutely. You have to shake it off and be happy. That's it.  Life, you know, continues, time goes, and that's a matter of preference. You are happy or you are not. I was just on another call, not an interview, but it's so funny because we were talking about confidence and Taylor Swift came into the conversation as well.

So yeah, she's, she's become a household name.  So confidence,  you know, I work with a lot of high performers.  executives, athletes.  And it's interesting because you would think,  and I'm in this category as well because I'm a, I'm a mega high achiever, right?  And you would think high achievers, athletes, executives, things like that, confidence wouldn't be  something that you deal with.

And I find that is the number one  area where high achievers  tend to  have to work on more than anything else.  Is that confidence? Do you find that as well?  You mean self confidence or something? Self confidence or even, you know, it can be confidence in the product that you're delivering as well. I mean, it's, it still comes down to you and your confidence and your beliefs. 

Yes. And yeah, that's a very good question. And you hit the right to the point, you know, um, if you are interested in my opinion, I can tell you the following, my personal discoveries say that.  Once you're confident in yourself,  then it's easy to manage things around. And this self confidence doesn't appear out of the blue, right?

So we have to work on it. So how do I work? It's, uh, for sure it's sports. And progressing no matter what, no matter how, but every day learn a little bit more, uh, jump a little bit further, farther, uh, you know, just, um, uh, do some like sub something you have to progress every day. So, and the easiest way to, uh, we've, we've all, I believe, heard and read books and, uh, heard some POSCO was, or listening to some POSCO podcasts. 

And we all know this  And, um, you know, how to raise your confidence and the formula, actually it's, uh, it's quite,  there is no universal formula that you see. So this is the point. So there are general accommodations, but then everything is up to you. And, um, reducing the stress is for everyone.  It's quite challenging thing, especially when you have family, you have kids, you have plans and  then suddenly bad weather, but the. 

Something in bed today and it ruined everything. So stability is also. Something that, that needs to be managed, but I'm talking about only myself. How do I fight with confidence? I mean, sorry, how do I find, uh,  try to shake all the stress from me? It all depends. There is no universal formula. A video, a book, a call to family.

Sometimes helps also. So it's, yeah, yeah, you're right. It's definitely, it's definitely, what about you Cindy? How do you, yeah, reduce stress level? Yeah. Well, you know, my stress, I, oh, you know, I, I do a lot of deep breathing. I use mantras.  I meditate. If I'm really, really stressed, I will just stop everything  wherever I am, or I have a couch behind me.

That's why it's there. I go back there  and we'll sit and meditate. And that, you know, because when we're stressed, what's happening is, is,  you know,  we're, we're designed as humans to have that fight or flight.  within us, right? It's in our DNA. Yeah, absolutely. And so stress, stress is like a made up word, right?

Like we made up that word. I think it was, I read something, it was like back in the twenties or whatever. They, they wanted to put a name on something. So they called it stress. What's really happening. It's just kind of anxiety,  right? Stress is really anxiety.  Um, and you're anxious because there's something that you're afraid of. 

There's fear in there, right? It's always fear. You're stressed. Oh, you know, I got to get to this appointment on time and you're resting, racing down the road.  You call it stress, but you're really just anxious. But what's really happening is you, you just are afraid you're going to be late and you don't want to be late.

Right? So, so for me, it's just about stopping and recognizing what's going on.  Okay.  It's like that, you stop, you're triggered, there's something that triggers you, you stop  and pause and you're like, you notice, okay, what's going on around me,  and then  you have a choice.  Right. You have a choice as to how you're going to respond, how you're going to respond.

Now, let me tell you folks, nine out of 10 times, I will choose the high road, but there's always that one time  when I'm just like, you know what, I'm human.  The happiest humans are those that experience a full range of emotions. And right now I'm going to choose to get pissed off,  right? And that's my choice. 

It's my choice. I'm like, yes, I know I, I, I, and I hate to use the word should, I ought not to react this way, but sometimes darn it, you just have to, right? Sometimes you just have to let it out and that's okay too.  There you go.  Thank you.  Very interesting. And, uh, you know, here I support you, uh, oppose is always needed before, you know, to, to understand what's, what's around,  that's, that's for sure.

That always works.  Yeah. Because when you think about it,  it's so easy to make up a story about, you know, what you think is going to happen  or what you thought happened, right? We project backwards. Oh, well, I bet this happened or dah, dah, dah, dah. We project forward.  Well, I think this is, this is the next thing that's going to happen or whatever.

And, and all we're doing is we're making up stories in our mind  that aren't based in  current reality or facts or right. We're just making it up.  Uh, let me tell you one very interesting story that happened to me when I was, uh, doing a transatlantic flight from Portland, Oregon to Berlin, Germany.  It was, it happened actually exactly five years ago.

So today is fifth and I started my journey on the 4th of September. During, uh, so there was a  hurricane that was the name, uh, Mike,  yeah. And Miami,  I believe it was Mike. Yeah. Yeah. We can Google it up, but I believe it was Mike. And so what happened? Uh, we see weather forecast forecast, uh, around, uh, dense  populated areas.

Right. So weather predictions and forecasts, there is no sense for, um, Uh, this weather prediction to build models and so on to  around specific areas of our planet. When you cross Atlantic Ocean, you fly five  days out of seven in radio silence.  So you have no connection, uh, with, so you have no opportunity to check weather conditions and sometimes weather can change.

And this is what actually happened with me. So when I passed Duluth, um,  uh,  and, uh, Happy Valley Goose Bay, which is in Canada, this was the final point where radio contact could be established with, uh, mutual services and, uh, aircraft, uh, big aircraft do not fly. And. When I crossed the whole United States, I turned to the North Pole and like to Canada, direction Canada and north to the North Pole. 

And we trapped the same night, uh, at the parallel 63 to 64, we trapped into a huge storm, which was around five times bigger than Mike. But since no weather, uh, meteor information was there, it appeared like it happens right now.  Hurricane season out of the blue and, uh, I was trapped in my aircraft with copilots, which I hired because it's, uh,  uh, dangerous to fly alone, do transatlantic alone on a single engine piston aircraft, Cyrus Cirrus SR 22. 

And, uh, what happened? Uh, let me explain a level of stress and everything once we touch this point. I can't even imagine the level of stress.  And I was also thinking, Alexey, that's exactly when you're making up stories. And in that situation, you need to make up possible scenarios of how to, how to respond.

Yeah. Yeah. So, um, Yeah.  When you fly over, uh, those, uh, parallels, so up, uh, and rising up to the North Pole, uh, on your aircraft. So there,  there are only two points of destination. One you took off from, and the second one is where you actually are flying. There is no alternative, um, uh, lending, uh, runways around, around in the distance of, uh,  300 miles or so, 150. 

And we were exactly in between, uh, takeoff destination, the starting point and the end point. And when this, when the wind, uh, the wind speed side, we had exactly side wind,  uh, raised the level of 65,  I believe knots, which is  quite a lot. That's, uh, let's say, uh, uh, 100.  20 miles per hour. Yeah. And yeah, we had a very strong side wind and we understood that we are in the whirlpool, but we couldn't understand which point exactly.

So which, how can you take a decision where, and you are right in the middle of your route. So to, to go back is not the right probably choice, but to continue also. And if you have hail, for example,  and, and there is no alternative airport and to,  So, uh, the calculation was if we, and you have, if you have a face, face, wind, very strong.

For example, you just fly and this is a small aircraft and you stand at one point, you see, and then you run, oh my gosh. Out of fuel. Yeah. So, right. Yeah. You'd run outta gas doing that. You run, yeah. Yeah. You run out of gas. And it was such a, such a stressful situation for me. You know, my first transatlantic flight, and this was, uh. 

And you, you simply don't take any decision because, um,  uh, you cannot take any decision. There is no right decision because you have no information what happens around to take the right decision.  You have no radio contact. You have, you cannot transmit blind or, uh, you can transmit blind, but you have no ability to receive  a call.

So, yeah, so we, we've implemented some basic things. We would use the altitude. Probably the wind would be lower. We flew on flight level 210.  This is, uh, let's say, 21, 000 feet.  Yeah, and we just continued to fly, and we were safe at the end. So it was so big. When we landed, we took a look at it. It was so big,  uh, stretched for 1, 300 miles.

Oh my gosh. Long. Yeah. Yeah, so, and we were lucky we were not in a whirlpool. It was just starting, so it was  But yes, one hour, um, we were in the situation where we will probably be trapped in the world and there will be no way back and there was no right decision because you had no conditions matter of chance.

So yeah, this was my first  flight and you know what I wanted to tell you. And so you cannot fight with distress. You understand that you are in the situation where there is no exit. Just.  We decided not to take  any decision, just to continue the way  it was right.  Yeah. That's it.  How, how did you make? And so when you think about this kind of. 

Right. I mean, that's a level of stress that most people could never even wrap their head around. Right. Unless you're think my, my, my, my, my, my fear went gray immediately, like at least 10%. Yeah, I mean, how did you keep,  because the thing is, is, you know, when you're in a situation like that, that's so stressful,  you have to keep your head straight, right?

So that you can make the right decisions. Otherwise you could die, right? It, I mean, you're, that literally was a life and death situation. I mean, not to be dramatic, but it, kind of was. How did you keep, how did you keep calm? How did you keep calm? Like knowing that  your hands were tied, that you were just flying a plane blindly and not knowing if you were going to make it through? 

Um, you know, Sandhya, I still remember my every emotion there. And, uh, I'm a bit proud of my, yeah, I, I, I'm, even a bit proud of myself. So first decision that I made that no stress at all, because you, you are simply in this situation and you know, I tried to raise a level of curiosity inside of myself. So what will happen next?

What will happen next? Okay. Great. If we will have to, I'm sorry.  Um, yeah. And, um, I just continue to watch the instrument panel  and to,  I put on some nice music. It was night, late night, around 12, around midnight.  So you're flying in the dark.  Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Watching instruments, um, taking my  lantern, um, observing, uh, aircraft's wings, uh, In case of ice accumulation, for example, which is dangerous.

And that's it. There is no actually many things you can do. There are no,  there are not so many things you could do in this situation. So you just relax and try to calm down. But  first couple of minutes, maybe up to 10 minutes, it was really stressful. And then you fight with yourself. You just, you have to fight with yourself.

There is no exit, you know. You're, you're trapped already. There is no exit. So you just hold  that's it, you know,  so looking back  five, that was five years ago.  Are you able to pull from that experience  and, and be like, you know what, I made it through that. I got this. Right. I mean, I would imagine that would be as  a, a source of strength for you.

Right.  Right. Cause I know like for me, like I, I completed a marathon  and anytime I think that something is too hard, I have to say, you know what, you ran a marathon.  You know, that was probably one of the hardest things I'd ever done. Well,  relatively speaking. And so, you know, you have that to, to fall back on that.

You can use that.  Do you ever, do you ever reflect back on it? Yes. And you are describing exactly  what it needs to be done. Uh, because when.  You remember your every achievement, it makes, uh, you feel much stronger because, uh, we all have achievements  and for you, an achievement is, uh, might be one thing for another person and achievement might be another thing.

And this is.  Uh, this is where, uh, it needs to be used actually. So, of course, uh, you know, we have a very good expression. So what happens in this, in that aircraft? I don't know. I, I, I accepted this, so it,  I accepted that. We'll, not, uh,  a, a situation, a possible scenario where the, we will simply crash and probably that will be the end.

And, you know,  if you die once. You cannot die twice, right? So, out of that experience, answering your question, what did I pull? If I, if you died once, you cannot die twice. Of course, remembering and coming back to those, that day, I died there in that aircraft. So I accepted this and it was quite peaceful for me.

And, uh, I just put on music.  Watched instruments, tried to enjoy every single moment around my aircraft, you know, yeah.  Watching with my  additional light,  observing, trying to do my professional pilot job in the best professional way. There is nothing else I could enjoy with, you know. And in one, in one  hour, when we are probably, we'll reach our final point and in two hours and a half we landed. 

Yeah, that's a good experience actually. Very good.  Yeah, I mean, you can look at it that way now. you know.  Yeah, yeah, that's true, that's true.  So,  they say that flying an aircraft is so much safer than driving a car. And I believe that, right? When you compare the number of car accidents,  To the number of plane crashes. 

I don't know, like, you know, I get in my car all the time and don't even think about it. But when I'm taking a plane, I sit there and I've got this, I've got this ritual that I do. And I'm, and I'm not a superstitious person, except for when I'm on an airplane that I have to say this at least three times, but I usually say it about 10, right?

It's like, it's kind of a prayer.  And I have to sit there and I'm like, And I don't do that. Like, what is that? Right? Because  you're safer up there than you are on the roads. And yet,  I don't even think that getting in my car could be the last time I'm driving down the road, but I could easily, you know, be killed in a car accident, right? 

As a pilot, I can tell you the following.  What I think, what I personally think that, um,  people are scared of flight because first they don't know how the aircraft work and they don't see the front, uh, only side. So, so the, uh, passengers  have an opportunity only to look sideways, right?  So left or right side first.

So you don't see what, what's in front and this is the most scary things for, because we are human beings. We need to know what's there, you know, behind this wall.  And this is first and second, 

uh,  what I think why people are scared because I'm not scared at all. So, but I was guessing why? Because there is no exit. When you have turbulence, uh, which is,  um, people, you, you can, you can, you can stop the car, but automatically people like how human brain works, tries to escape. And you know that there is no escape.

The aircraft cannot stop. There are a lot of people and, uh, and that's it. And if we fall like 100%.  No one will survive because in any aircraft, uh, in most cases during when this unfortunate event happens and, uh, an aircraft, we have a  witness,  uh, uh, an aircraft crash,  most probably no one survives, right? So this is the scary thing as well, but yes, by statistics and passenger travel, passenger, um,  uh, volume, the travels, uh, of course, this is the safest transport.

Even safer than the trade. I don't know.  Even for me, it's surprising.  I know. I know.  It's still, and like, I think it's probably different for every person. For me, it's, it's probably the lack of control because I, I want to be the driver.  Yeah. Lack of control is one of the reasons. That's for sure. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I prefer to be the one in front of the, you know, behind the steering wheel. So, so real quickly, tell us about your company and what you have going on, because I'd love to hear a little bit about this hydrogen powered, um,  aircraft.  We're creating the world's most amazing aircraft. This is a revolutionary  jet that will operate in liquid hydrogen.

And, uh, that has multiple applications, cargo, air ambulance, um, business jet. And, uh, it has unique, uh, possibility to take off and land vertically. And you know, my favorite, wow. So it's, yeah, it. It's like a helicopter. Yeah. And one of the biggest, biggest benefit, actually, it has very low noise comparable to your vacuum cleaner.

And, uh, another great thing is that it's very cheap because the cost of hydrogen, even today, it was present prices is just 2. 2 per gallon. Okay. Let's say 8 per gallon.  So, which is, uh, not that much, you know, for aircraft and the full fuel tank for, uh, maximum distance, which is 1, 100 miles is only 65 kilograms, uh, which is, uh, 100, let's say 50 pounds.

So it's, that's really reasonable. Yeah. Really reasonable and the cost of operation you have only one moving part in big aircraft. You have a lot of moving part and the cost of services is great and in the ticket that you buy 80 percent is the cost of service and fuel. So we just reduce that literally  to,  uh, let's say 70%. 

So it will be very cheap, very convenient, unique way of transport, silent, a vertical takeoff and landing, and absolutely sustainable.  And, um,  it sounds so futuristic, right? Yeah.  I don't know if you remember, you may, you may be too young and you may not have seen it where you live. Um, there was a popular, uh, Show on that was done like in the sixties called the Jetsons.

It was a cartoon. Uh, probably. I don't. Yeah. But, but they had the, the air, you know, the, yeah, anyway,  yeah,  it's, it's also designed by a very famous studio based in LA, actually, um, uh, with the European roots. Uh, it's BMW's internal, uh, design studio that is called, Uh,  BMW group design works  studio. It's an amazing team.

Our designer, Tommy Fosgreen is one of probably top five, uh,  uh,  best designers of the world. Um, and he designed actually BMW X6. Yeah, this is his, uh, his product as well. I cannot say about other things that he does, but he's involved in multiple mobility projects. Okay.  Yeah.  So are these, are these planes going to be available  for the private sector to purchase or, or are you targeting regional air, air traffic? 

We are, uh, having  the, so the business, uh, the idea of this aircraft to start sales.  So private, uh, individuals still for ultra high networks or high networks in the middle of why, because they have the biggest pressure today from society.  Let's take a look at Taylor Swift at, uh, Mr. DiCaprio and many, many more that have social pressure.

And we are really willing to help them first,  um, to get. Like to, you know, eliminate this problem for them because you see, they, they are business people, first of all, right? And they, they need to travel. This is time. They save a lot of time and people need to understand this. They have no exit. If, if, if there, if there, there was an opportunity for them to use another mean of transfer, it's sustainable.

Who of them would say no, right? So  this is the biggest problem. Um, and  speaking, uh,  Uh,  speaking money wise, that makes more sense for us because margins for business jets are bigger. So initially we plan to sell and offer business jets to, uh, private individuals  to help them. And for those who are interested in, in, uh,  in this trend and fashion and who cares about the planet and wants to fly zero emission.

There are a lot of people. This is a very big trend in the United States and Australia, the first customers,  all customers, Australian  and our sales team is Australian.  Um, so,  but we have multiple applications, as I said, uh, cargo. Air ambulance. And when the cheap is so low for operation, so operation costs of this aircraft is quite low.

So it will be used a lot to deliver critical, uh, things or even not expensive cargo to, um,  to specific destinations. Yeah. No, it sounds incredible. Food. Food, for example.  Yeah, exactly. Food, things like that. Well, I, I was having a conversation a couple of days ago and they were talking about, you know, executives using private jets and, and yeah, there, there is a responsibility there. 

And I love this option because they, they use the thing. They're like having a jet for somebody like Taylor Swift. It's a time machine.  is what they were calling it. It's like a time machine because you're getting your time back, right? You're saving so much time.  Absolutely. Yeah. I agree with you. This is a real time machine.

And you know, we don't have to blame business people in what they're doing. They're flying private jets  for their own purpose. First of all, they can afford it.  And second, they can do many things. And third, we are in America  and, uh, how America, this is the American, uh, achievement and, uh,  mobility and this luxury, and this was all created in the United States.

And this is the whole idea of capitalism, right? So, and today to say and blame these people that you are traveling to a party with an empty plane. Yes, there is, there should be some social responsibility. They can take, uh, maybe their friends more,  but we're not at their place. You see, and we are struggling right now to expedite the, uh, design process of our aircraft, of serious jet to be able to offer, uh, the open market so that people would like the soonest. 

Nice. I love it.  Is there anything else that you want to mention before we finish up today, Alexey?  Sanjeev, only if you would like me to,  uh, to,  to tell you or to explain you something. In general, thank you very much. I really enjoyed, uh, uh, I'm saying hello to all your audience and, uh, I find, uh, that you are doing a very valuable job  and your podcast, uh,  its contribution is absolutely invaluable, Ebony.

So people,  many people should find the, some answers in your, uh, in the guests that you invite. And again, thank you for inviting me. Appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. I, I feel like that, and Alexi, you, you provided so much valuable information because those are situations that a lot of times people just don't know how to, how to deal with it  and, and hearing someone else's story, you hear it and, and they, you resonate with and you're like, oh my gosh.

And then the next time you're in that, in a situation that may feel similar, be like, oh my gosh, I heard Alexi talk about when he was on that transatlantic flight.  And, you know, didn't know if he was going to get out, you know, and that, that, and he did, and he's staying calm and he, like, that's, that's going to help somebody.

Yeah, I hope so. I hope so. Right. No, so I appreciate it very, very much. Yeah. And thank you for the work that you're doing. I mean, it's, we really need more of these planes, you know,  all the airlines ought to have some, even if it's just from like DC to New York. Right. You know, like  when you're just hopping city to city.

I mean, that's, that's how this would really come into, you know, be just a huge benefit.  Yeah. And you know, if, if someone would find my advice useful, I don't know from the audience, I would like to share that, um, my personal way of thinking that, uh,  again, coming back to what we started from. So to be happy is the matter of your personal preference.

And I discovered that when,  uh, when I became CEO, actually of this very,  very, let's say,  I, I, I started this very challenging life path to become a CEO of a very deep of a deep tech company in aircraft design. And of course, as CEO, you have only, you hear only about bad things because if something is right, so no one asks you what to do, for example, and you deal with a lot of problems.

So when, when the level of pressure, um, increased dramatically, I understood that the, like. I just need to do something with it and how you fight. You just make a decision. Oh, I'm happy with this. I'm happy with that. And then you, you just step into the, into the next level. So  for all of us, level of pressure is absolutely same.

It's just the matter, what you decide to do to stay happy or to stay, uh, Or to be, you know, to stay unhappy. So I, I, I wish everyone to find his own way, how to change, um, uh, his mindset to switch this, you know, small switch into the happy mode.  That's right. That's right. It's a switch. And I wish all of, yeah, I wish all of your success.

You'll find your way.  Aw, thank you. Thank you so much for joining us today, Alexi. His company is Sirius Jet and you can find that@siriusjet.com.  And uh, yeah, check out his, check out the product. And, uh, thank you all for listening today and I hope that you and your family are happy and safe.  Yeah, and take care everyone.

Thanks so much.